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Posted by Reel McKoi on October 12, 2007, 12:26 pm
Please log in for more thread options Well they're dying right on time as I feared. The advice I got here that
they adapt to hard alkaline water isn't true, as least not for us here in
middle TN. I should have known better not to buy them, as it was their
death sentence and a waste of money. I'm down to 7 neons from a dozen, and
3 of the 5 black neons died. Two of the lemon tetras also died and 1
Sherpae.
So far the rest look fine.
Ammonia - 0
Nitrate - 20
Nitrite - 0
Hardness - 150 ppm
Alk - 180
PH - 8.4
I was told by the owner of one place that all the shops in this area keep
the PH at 7 as it's best for most fish. But it's presenting problems when
people get their fish home. The PH from our taps here is way higher, and
the fish are not always adapting. I mean, from a PH of 7 to PHs as high as
7.8 to 8.4? Now, get this, before they'll make good on the fish you have to
bring in water samples. Is this for real? Anyone can adulterate the water
before bringing it in for them to check. These fish kept at 7 at the
wholesalers and pet stores are going to have a adapt to water many many
times more alkaline then they've been kept in for who knows how
long......... it's bad news.
--
RM....
Zone 6. Middle TN USA
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö>
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Posted by Jeffrey St. Clair, Ph.D. on October 12, 2007, 1:49 pm
Please log in for more thread options
Why not buy a neutralizer, such as this one? :)
http://www.petsolutions.com/Neutral-Regulator+I10103060+C48.aspx
> Well they're dying right on time as I feared. The advice I got here that
> they adapt to hard alkaline water isn't true, as least not for us here in
> middle TN. I should have known better not to buy them, as it was their
> death sentence and a waste of money. I'm down to 7 neons from a dozen,
> and 3 of the 5 black neons died. Two of the lemon tetras also died and 1
> Sherpae.
>
> So far the rest look fine.
>
> Ammonia - 0
> Nitrate - 20
> Nitrite - 0
> Hardness - 150 ppm
> Alk - 180
> PH - 8.4
>
> I was told by the owner of one place that all the shops in this area keep
> the PH at 7 as it's best for most fish. But it's presenting problems when
> people get their fish home. The PH from our taps here is way higher, and
> the fish are not always adapting. I mean, from a PH of 7 to PHs as high as
> 7.8 to 8.4? Now, get this, before they'll make good on the fish you have
> to bring in water samples. Is this for real? Anyone can adulterate the
> water before bringing it in for them to check. These fish kept at 7 at
> the wholesalers and pet stores are going to have a adapt to water many
> many times more alkaline then they've been kept in for who knows how
> long......... it's bad news.
> --
>
> RM....
> Zone 6. Middle TN USA
> ~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö>
>
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Posted by atomweaver on October 12, 2007, 2:08 pm
Please log in for more thread options top-posting repaired.
>> I was told by the owner of one place that all the shops in this area
>> keep the PH at 7 as it's best for most fish. But it's presenting
>> problems when people get their fish home. The PH from our taps here
>> is way higher, and the fish are not always adapting. I mean, from a
>> PH of 7 to PHs as high as 7.8 to 8.4? Now, get this, before they'll
>> make good on the fish you have to bring in water samples. Is this for
>> real? Anyone can adulterate the water before bringing it in for them
>> to check. These fish kept at 7 at the wholesalers and pet stores are
>> going to have a adapt to water many many times more alkaline then
>> they've been kept in for who knows how long......... it's bad news.
>> --
> Why not buy a neutralizer, such as this one? :)
>
> http://www.petsolutions.com/Neutral-Regulator+I10103060+C48.aspx
>
With his hardness and alkalinity, the water is fairly well buffered against
pH changes. It'd be hard/expensive to treat with chemicals to get it down
to the pH 7 that the store is at. pH 8.0 is 10x more alkaline than pH 7.0.
If you _really_ want to keep pH neutral, or fish that like soft, acidic
water, you'll probably need to get an RO/DI unit, and make up water to your
deisred pH by mixing RO with tap water. (Of course, that purchase puts
your feet firmly on the road to keeping either discus, or a reef tank...
but there are worse fates in life ;-)
If it were me, I'd go with the flow, and set up an African rift lake tank,
instead...
DaveZ
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Posted by Reel McKoi on October 12, 2007, 2:56 pm
Please log in for more thread options
>
> With his hardness and alkalinity, the water is fairly well buffered
> against
> pH changes. It'd be hard/expensive to treat with chemicals to get it down
> to the pH 7 that the store is at. pH 8.0 is 10x more alkaline than pH
> 7.0.
There you go my friend. Those I know here have given up trying to lower our
PH.
> If you _really_ want to keep pH neutral, or fish that like soft, acidic
> water, you'll probably need to get an RO/DI unit, and make up water to
> your
> deisred pH by mixing RO with tap water. (Of course, that purchase puts
> your feet firmly on the road to keeping either discus, or a reef tank...
> but there are worse fates in life ;-)
If you have the income for such things. :-)) Us retired folk have to watch
our pennies. The people in one shop are recommending using those jugs of
water from the grocery store to dilute the water in their tanks to soften it
and lower the PH. But those bottles are $1 each. Ok for a small tank
maybe, but when you have 20s and over you're looking at a serious cost here.
:(
> If it were me, I'd go with the flow, and set up an African rift lake tank,
> instead...
>
> DaveZ
I had them already and yes, they THRIVED and reproduced to the point the
local market was flooded with fry I sold or traded them. My only complaints
with them was the constant fighting and they size they reach - some were
over 6" long when I sold them. Evan an all male tank can become WWIII.
There are smaller varieties of Africans but none are peaceful that I know
of. I'm going to see how the groumies do. I may have to just give up on
the pretty schools of tetras I had my heart set on. :*(
--
RM....
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö>
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Posted by Steve Wolstenholme on October 12, 2007, 6:18 pm
Please log in for more thread options On Fri, 12 Oct 2007 13:56:59 -0500, "Reel McKoi"
>
>>
>> With his hardness and alkalinity, the water is fairly well buffered
>> against
>> pH changes. It'd be hard/expensive to treat with chemicals to get it down
>> to the pH 7 that the store is at. pH 8.0 is 10x more alkaline than pH
>> 7.0.
>
>There you go my friend. Those I know here have given up trying to lower our
>PH.
>
On the other hand, some of us keep fishes that prefer high pH. pH 8.0
is ideal for the fishes that I keep.
Steve
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> they adapt to hard alkaline water isn't true, as least not for us here in
> middle TN. I should have known better not to buy them, as it was their
> death sentence and a waste of money. I'm down to 7 neons from a dozen,
> and 3 of the 5 black neons died. Two of the lemon tetras also died and 1
> Sherpae.
>
> So far the rest look fine.
>
> Ammonia - 0
> Nitrate - 20
> Nitrite - 0
> Hardness - 150 ppm
> Alk - 180
> PH - 8.4
>
> I was told by the owner of one place that all the shops in this area keep
> the PH at 7 as it's best for most fish. But it's presenting problems when
> people get their fish home. The PH from our taps here is way higher, and
> the fish are not always adapting. I mean, from a PH of 7 to PHs as high as
> 7.8 to 8.4? Now, get this, before they'll make good on the fish you have
> to bring in water samples. Is this for real? Anyone can adulterate the
> water before bringing it in for them to check. These fish kept at 7 at
> the wholesalers and pet stores are going to have a adapt to water many
> many times more alkaline then they've been kept in for who knows how
> long......... it's bad news.
> --
>
> RM....
> Zone 6. Middle TN USA
> ~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö>
>